a real bad day

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Postby mspanners » Sat Feb 28, 2009 3:05 pm

Get well soon......

My jobs been on the line since I put in for voluntary redundancy in 2005....

Had an interview with Site Manager & personnel and was informed that I would be one of the last to go as Engineering Skills are so scarce and the company has to take on short term people to cover the Skills gap!

I may be redundant between Mid May - Mid April.....

I volunteered in October 2005!!

3 & 1/2 Years on a redundancy list! :shock:

And to cap it all people who never put in for it have been let go of.... :?

Transport and General Union at our place are C*ap.
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Postby Tiffany » Sat Feb 28, 2009 6:02 pm

You are obviously one who is indispensable. Sadly for you :( if you want to retire early.
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Postby mspanners » Sun Mar 01, 2009 10:59 am

Retire early! I wish no I am only 47 but the redundancy package will clear my Mortgage so I will take the Gamble and see if I can't get another job in Engineering.... We have had a Milk packers opened up here last Year and the Electricity people are going to put in a couple of reactors at Hinkley Point at some time in the near future. I will send my CV out to these places and a few other around the County but to be honest I do not really care if I stay in Engineering.

We get treated like the folks from Terry's Books Going Postal.

Engineers are seen as nothing in this country .... Four Years In Training on low pay and Five at Technical Collage to get HND and then Yearly retraining on new equipment, then I have to get qualified in Electrical to City and Guilds standard or get the push ........... then they say we are doing away with the post of Technician (Senior Engineer) and making up the post of Senior operator!

So now not only do you have to keep the things running and maintained you have to run them as well! ...........................

Stick a broom up my *rse and I could sweep the floor whist I am running around................ As Moist had said. :shock:

I don't think so.......

Now if I were a fat cat big city banker with a Six hundred Thousand pounds pension people would take a different approch ,I am sure.
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Postby Jan Van Quirm » Sun Mar 01, 2009 12:35 pm

I do sympathise mspanners :roll:

There seems to be something very wrong in western culture techno industries (all over the employment sector in fact but in IT, electronics and engineering in particular). I'm an ex-civil servant so I have had vast experience of the muddled thinking and frankly stupid discriminatory attitudes they have towards the people whose job skills actually make things happen and instead give huge kudos and salaries to match to middle and higher managers and especially to consultants and contractors.

I was a webmaster and design team leader so I saw both sides of the fence as I was promoted from the ranks and loved my 'lowly' graphic design work for print and then as a web developer. I was very good at my job and with no boasting they were frankly lucky to have me as I had a good grounding in the essential business of my Dept having worked in courts for over 20 years and retrained at my own expense at Camberwell College so I actually understood what I was designing for really well. I could have made a lot more than 21K a year if I'd buggered off to work in the creative marketing or print industry sectors - this was in London so there were plenty of much more rewarding and lucrative opportunities around.

I wish to hell and back I had never taken the managerial job as it drew me away from 'hands on' work I loved. I found myself better off of course - I then made 25K for going up a grade and as 2 of my developers promptly buggered off for a rather larger pay rise in more or less the same type of work I then worked hard to get more financial recognition and status for my 'staff' so they would be less tempted to jump ship as well. That took over 2 years and by that time I was very ill from the stress (not wholly from that, but it bloody well had the most effect) and moved from design & development into project management...

What a bloody con that is! And what a gravy train too - I worked with 2 other higher graded colleagues and 2 consultants - the junior of those made nearly twice as much my boss and it gradually dawned on me just how much people who actually do all the brain or spadework were in fact less highly regarded and certainly paid than people who essentially go to lots of meetings and spend of the day fiddling around in MS Project drawing pretty charts and calculating 'risk' assessments and 'critical paths' so that the project which is actually 'managed'... :evil:

To quote Jim Royle 'risk assessment my arse!' I could give them a meaningful risk assessment - what if the people who were constructing the network systems or websites or payment engine parameters withdrew their labour - they sure as hell don't get made by pretty project charts. And the same thing if you're designing and building a bridge or bringing a telecoms systems onto a better operating system.

We don't NEED half of these bloody peripheral skills people (I admit they have something to contribute but they're certainly not worth their fat pay packets over the people who contribute the brain power or practical skills) and we should instead be educating and encouraging those who actually do the essential work - the NHS being the biggest and worst example I can think of where the support administration staff are surely not as essential as medical workers and equipment and should certainly not earn more than say nurses instead of getting a surgeon's salary for being a sodding junior accountant :evil:

I think we're actually in dire need of Vetinari's administrative skills here in round world! :lol:
"Some men see things as they are and ask why. Others dream things that never were and ask why not.” George Bernard Shaw
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Postby mspanners » Sun Mar 01, 2009 4:31 pm

I just do not understand industry ........... the TV and papers go on about Skills shortages and taking up apprenticeships but the company I work for wants its Engineering staff to run the machines !

A good use of Skilled craftsmen ? I think not... it is all about cost cutting and laying off unskilled people who were the ones how made a living out of running the production lines. :?

Just a tip to anyone who is young and considering a career in Engineering............. Don't bother as it is a thankless task. Every shift you work you will have someone on your case wanting miracles of Engineering done at zero cost. When you do the impossible you will not get any thanks for it and the Boss will claim any Kudos for your work at the next company meeting.

On the occasion you fail to come up with an instant solution you will be dragged over the coals for it.

Go into banking or one of the other clean and safe jobs maybe like insurance......... you will get more respect from others than as an Engineer.

And you will not end up half deaf and crotchety like I have! :shock:

In this country any way........ moan over! :D
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Postby WannabeAngua » Sun Mar 01, 2009 7:34 pm

Move to Norway, we need you :)
Can't tell you for sure, but think the pay isn't too bad when you have a few years experience.
Lovely here during the summer...(Not sure if there's a lot of snow wintertime where you live, but know some of "you english" don't enjoy snow very much :wink: )

Seriously, hope it works out for you.
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Postby mspanners » Sun Mar 01, 2009 7:48 pm

Move to Norway......... :shock: Some where warmer and I might have been tempted. :wink:
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Postby WannabeAngua » Sun Mar 01, 2009 7:57 pm

Well, can't really blame you.
Was -20 degrees centigrade yesterday morning when I got up...and about two ft. of snow...
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Postby Catch-up » Sun Mar 01, 2009 10:48 pm

Ouch! Belated HUGS to Chris and Pooh. Hope you're both feeling better now!
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Postby chris.ph » Mon Mar 02, 2009 6:39 pm

cheers catch up. how expensive is booze in norway wannabe angua that will put spanners off even more :lol:
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Postby Who's Wee Dug » Mon Mar 02, 2009 7:10 pm

It's that expensive I have been told by some Norwegians that they sometimes go over the Border for a weekend on the bevy. :)
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Postby WannabeAngua » Mon Mar 02, 2009 7:19 pm

It's been ages since I went out for a pint, but guess you have to pay about 7 pounds for a beer... It's horrendous, I know :oops:
And if you like drinking gin&tonic or cosmopolitan it's more like 10-12 pounds.

Whenever we visit Sweden or Denmark (or England for that matter) we always bring back something strong for our coctail cabinet :wink:
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Postby mspanners » Mon Mar 02, 2009 7:49 pm

So long as Cider is cheap I could cope.......

Coz I i'z from da Wez cuntry Me ol Lubber, Zommerzet. :lol:
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Postby Jan Van Quirm » Mon Mar 02, 2009 9:47 pm

mspanners wrote:So long as Cider is cheap I could cope.......

Coz I i'z from da Wez cuntry Me ol Lubber, Zommerzet. :lol:


Yay Wez country! - but don't forget the vital ingredient of Scrumpy - the dead rat (homebrew cider with off-the scale alcohol content).

Actually would the Dwarves like Scrumpy/cider - I think we should be told... :lol:
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Postby Who's Wee Dug » Tue Mar 03, 2009 12:22 am

I cant drink the scrumpty with the rat init cause I'm a veggie. :lol:
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