Merlin

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Postby Batty » Thu Sep 23, 2010 8:16 pm

Tiffany wrote:I don't care that it isn't historical correct, it's a fantasy so it doesn't matter.

I'll say it isn't historically correct! Guis was wearing spectacles in Series one, and there were also cans of lager on the banqueting table!

I am enjoying it though. I'm just waiting for one of the knights to produce a wristwatch ...
:roll:
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Postby Jan Van Quirm » Thu Sep 23, 2010 8:36 pm

So long as it has demons... :lol:
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Postby ghostsecurity28 » Thu Sep 23, 2010 9:35 pm

what year is merlin supposed to be set ?
And in Heather's case, there were sometimes Third Thoughts and Fourth Thoughts, although these were quite difficult to manage and sometimes led her to walk into doors
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Postby Jan Van Quirm » Fri Sep 24, 2010 12:21 am

No time - in legend it's supposed to be Dark Ages so post Roman occupation and pre-Norman conquest. It's a fantasy take so historically it's nonsense, but at least that lets them vamp up the special effects :lol:

In terms of arms and armour I suppose it's early medieval - lots of maille and a bit of plate here and there :wink:
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Postby ghostsecurity28 » Fri Sep 24, 2010 2:04 am

ah right so about 476ad to 1000ad , lol I know its legend but couldnt remember when arthur was supposed to exist :)
And in Heather's case, there were sometimes Third Thoughts and Fourth Thoughts, although these were quite difficult to manage and sometimes led her to walk into doors
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Postby michelanCello » Fri Sep 24, 2010 5:07 am

According to the legend, King Arthur lived in the 6th century, but there is no written source to proove this. He's first mentionned in Geoffrey of Monmouth's (hope I wrote his name right) Historia Britannea (or was it Brittannae?) where he mentinned a great king, who defeated the saxons. Rumour has it, that Arthur had a powerfull sourcerer, who was very wise and helped the king in his battles. But, of course, it's all just a legend, and no one knows where history ends and poetry begins.


(I know all this because last year - or was it the year before that? - I held a presentation about the arthurian legend...) :D
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Postby Tonyblack » Fri Sep 24, 2010 5:34 am

Just a couple of points there. Arthur was mentioned in early Welsh literature - as was Merlin, but never in the same stories. In these stories, Arthur was never called a king and the details are pretty sketchy - there's more known about Merlin.

Geoffrey of Monmouth was a Norman who was basically rewriting British history and trying to create a unity between the Britons, Saxons and the Normans. The irony is that the Saxons that Arthur beat were the English. Kind of surprising that the English embraced Arthur as their hero.

Most of the Arthur myth was written by the French and such things as Camelot and Lancelot were added then. :)
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Postby Tiffany » Fri Sep 24, 2010 9:16 pm

Batty wrote:
Tiffany wrote:I don't care that it isn't historical correct, it's a fantasy so it doesn't matter.

I'll say it isn't historically correct! Guis was wearing spectacles in Series one, and there were also cans of lager on the banqueting table!I am enjoying it though. I'm just waiting for one of the knights to produce a wristwatch ...
:roll:


I never noticed those. :D I must take more notice of the props.
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Postby Jugula » Sun Sep 26, 2010 10:50 am

michelanCello wrote:Don't know about the Netherlands, but I live in Hungary (most of the time...), and it sais that it's not available in my area... :( maybe Sjoerd should check.
But thanks for the link anyway! :D

Back to the dragon - which scorpions?? (is that already season three?)

Hi I live way down south in Hungary; I have been able to pick it up on a German sat dish channel, but it is maddening cos there are so many adverts!! Jugula
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Postby michelanCello » Sun Sep 26, 2010 3:31 pm

You live in Hungary? Where? :D

Anyway, we have this horrible UPC thing and we used to have a lot of german/english/dutch/etc, etc channels, but they changed something, and now they're all gone. :( We only get hungarian channels (and CNN and BBC news... which if OK, but not enough...)
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Postby Jugula » Sun Sep 26, 2010 3:40 pm

michelanCello wrote:You live in Hungary? Where? :D

Anyway, we have this horrible UPC thing and we used to have a lot of german/english/dutch/etc, etc channels, but they changed something, and now they're all gone. :( We only get hungarian channels (and CNN and BBC news... which if OK, but not enough...)

Down between Pecs and Kaposvar in a small village. I have a sat and it's tuned to Astra 1B 19 2E; gives me loads of German, Austrian, a few French and CNN, BBC News, CNBC, Euronews etc. Hoping to get a second sat which will then be tuned to Astra 28EAST which should then allow me top pick up some UK programs. Jugula :D
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Postby Bouncy Castle » Mon Sep 27, 2010 11:08 am

How can legends be "historically correct"?

OK glasses and a can of lager may be a bit OTT (to say the least!!), but you can't really diss the props (when it first aired, people were complaining that throwing tomatoes at someone is the stocks wasn't historically correct because tomatoes didn't arrive in England until the year UmptyNumpty).

After all, the legends state that Merlin was an old man when he assisted Arthur, who was still a young man when he became king.

This is just a re-working of the legends and doesn't have to be accurate. Heck, the whole premise of Merlin and Arthur being around the same age cancels the legends out entirely.
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Postby Jan Van Quirm » Mon Sep 27, 2010 11:52 am

Legends can generally be made to loosely 'fit' history in the way that the bible uses oral tradition from times before the world was officially 'there' and humans learnt to read and write.

Robin Hood could be based on any number of 'bandits' around the time of Richard the Lionheart, who supposedly lived rough in a wood and ambushed the odd taxman. Same with Arthur taken in context with the Romans leaving and the power vacuum they left where the native Britons (so Celts and their druids mainly, but Romano-British too) tried to repel Saxon-type pagan invaders etc.

Anyone remember Arthur of the Britonsback in the early 70s? Apart from the silly posing with swords and stones that's possibly as close as you can get to a reasonably 'historical' re-telling of the Arthur myths which had far more to do with later French knightly stories that owed more to warrior life in the 1200s CE. You could also justifiably argue that, for the possible historical niche, the Grail aspect of the legends are complete and utter cobblers since christianity became distinctly unpopular in Britain almost as soon as the last legion sodded off back to mainland Europe... :wink:

So this current Merlin's of a possible magical background and pushed into the knightly take without the christianity - it's fun and pure fantasy because it's all myth rather than 'quasi-real' or probable legend :lol:
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Postby Tonyblack » Mon Sep 27, 2010 11:58 am

I remember it. I think that was more like Arthur actually was - or as in the Bernard Cornwell books.

Incidentally, there's no evidence that Arthur and Merlin ever met. And there's at least two possible Merlins in Welsh ledgend.
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Postby Jan Van Quirm » Mon Sep 27, 2010 12:05 pm

Tonyblack wrote:I remember it. I think that was more like Arthur actually was - or as in the Bernard Cornwell books.

Definitely - Stephen Lawhead as well although he fuses that with Atlantean themes (so it's more technology rather than magic) with the surviving high caste Atlanteans taking the Fisher King and Lady of the Lake posts and 'civilising' the Celts (though they weren't at all savage) and taking to christianity more readily.
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