The Light Fantastic Discussion **Spoilers**

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Re: The Light Fantastic Discussion **Spoilers**

Postby S@mwich » Tue Jun 12, 2012 8:22 pm

I guess I see the couloir of magic as a 'the light fantastic 1' rather than the light fantastic being a 'couloir of magic 2'
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Re: The Light Fantastic Discussion **Spoilers**

Postby =Tamar » Thu Jun 14, 2012 2:50 am

S@mwich wrote:I guess I see the colour of magic as a 'the light fantastic 1' rather than the light fantastic being a 'colour of magic 2'

I feel pretty much the same way. I seriously disliked The Colour of Magic and wasn't going to read Pratchett again, but someone talked me into reading Equal Rites and I liked it. Some years later I read The Light Fantastic and that made up for the ending of the first book, so for me, TCoM is definitely only part one of The Light Fantastic.

I did have to go back and check thoroughly to be sure, but it's true: Rincewind first has a hat in, I think, Mort. In TCoM, he tells the dryad that he lost his hat, but the narration states that he lied when he said that. I think he got the hat after he went back to UU at the end of TLF. There wasn't anyone senior enough to tell him he couldn't have one - after all, he beat the then-chancellor in a fight, so he technically was the new Chancellor! Fortunately he also knew what that entailed, so he quit in favor of being the Librarian's assistant.
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Re: The Light Fantastic Discussion **Spoilers**

Postby =Tamar » Thu Jun 14, 2012 9:00 am

By the way, I thought of an explanation within-story for why Trymon's hair color changed.

It's given as black when he's described by the author, as seen by the wizards. It's given as blond (fair-haired) as Rincewind remembers him from his school years - they were in the same class. Rincewind is now said by Terry to be "about 40" (though actually if we can go by the airplane-switch in TCoM he was probably closer to 33 then) and Trymon just about remembers Rincewind. Because Trymon remembers him, I think they're close to the same age (though students apparently arrived at any age from about five to 14).

I think a good retcon for the hair would be that Trymon started dyeing his hair to look more impressively wizardly. On the other hand, sometimes people's hair does get darker with age. Either way, the wizards who were present when Rincewind referred to Trymon as fair-haired didn't react, but that could be explained by stress - Rincewind had just opened the door to free them from the Octavo room.

Looking at it from outside the text, the standard cliche for a powerful character is grey eyes and black hair. Trymon had grey eyes; he had also "elevated greyness to an art." Sort of an early version of an Auditor. (There are a lot of things in TLF that are used later!) In the standard cliches, the combination of grey eyes and blond hair is a much weaker character. Second-guessing, I think it's possible that Terry decided Trymon's image had to be weakened a bit to make it more convincing that Rincewind could win. Symbolically it might mean that Trymon didn't start out all that bad, he became what he was over the years of surviving in UU.
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Re: The Light Fantastic Discussion **Spoilers**

Postby raptornx01 » Thu Jun 14, 2012 1:07 pm

Ah, but can you explain, in story, the differences with Vetinari? :)
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Re: The Light Fantastic Discussion **Spoilers**

Postby =Tamar » Thu Jun 14, 2012 10:12 pm

raptornx01 wrote:Ah, but can you explain, in story, the differences with Vetinari? :)

Oh, well... lots of fans have found explanations. Such as:
Vetinari took over fairly young. He may have had to do a lot to convince the assorted power factors that he was not going to upset the system too much, at first. Either stress or faking being just another typical Patrician type could be a reason for having put on a little weight, which could have been deliberately exaggerated by wearing a fat-suit when appearing (briefly) at the parties (remember there was a Conga-line at the party where Death was trying to understand fun, but there is no mention of the Patrician actually appearing). It's faintly possible that he even had special gloves made to make his hands look fat. (Or he ate something that made his hands swell briefly.... that happens to me if I eat something I'm allergic to, and it would last for a short interview.)
If he really did gain that much weight, he later went on an extreme diet, and in order to stay thin (and possibly in emotional reaction against having gained the weight at first) he has stayed on a fairly rigorous maintenance diet. Hence the appearance of living on water and dry crackers.
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Re: The Light Fantastic Discussion **Spoilers**

Postby Dotsie » Fri Jun 15, 2012 8:32 am

Or, it wasn't Vetinari?
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Re: The Light Fantastic Discussion **Spoilers**

Postby Tonyblack » Fri Jun 15, 2012 10:21 am

Terry has gone on record as saying it was Vetinari. Yes, he appears to be a totally different character, but think of him as a prototype, rather than a different person. Like Granny Weatherwax in Equal Rites.
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Re: The Light Fantastic Discussion **Spoilers**

Postby Dotsie » Fri Jun 15, 2012 11:05 am

I'd like to go on record saying that Terry doesn't know as much about Discworld as the fans do ;) If we say it's not Vetinari, then it's not! :lol:
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Re: The Light Fantastic Discussion **Spoilers**

Postby raisindot » Fri Jun 15, 2012 12:46 pm

Dotsie wrote:I'd like to go on record saying that Terry doesn't know as much about Discworld as the fans do ;) If we say it's not Vetinari, then it's not! :lol:


Watch what you're saying: You're just asking for....fanfiction. :shock:
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Re: The Light Fantastic Discussion **Spoilers**

Postby raptornx01 » Fri Jun 15, 2012 12:56 pm

I believe Terry's quote was, "it was Vetinari written by a less experienced author"

One of the other theories was that it was Snapcase, which could fit i guess. Especially with the timeframe as purposed by Night watch.

also, it wasn't just the weight, but he was described as wearing jewelery as well, something vetinari later on wouldn't do (even his signet ring, which he could wear under a glove).

But I take Terry's word on it.
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Re: The Light Fantastic Discussion **Spoilers**

Postby Dotsie » Mon Jun 18, 2012 10:07 am

Death was also very different, and since there's only been one of him, I'm prepared to accept a trousers of time explanation. But fanfiction? Oh the horror! :lol:
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Re: The Light Fantastic Discussion **Spoilers**

Postby Tonyblack » Mon Jun 18, 2012 10:12 am

I don't know about that. Death's change is more logical and developed. He starts to change after his experiences in Mort. :)
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Re: The Light Fantastic Discussion **Spoilers**

Postby Dotsie » Mon Jun 18, 2012 10:21 am

No, in Mort he already likes cats, but in one of the first two he kills a cat. The Death after the first two books also makes it clear that he doesn't kill anyone ever - he's not evil or good, he's not really anything.
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Re: The Light Fantastic Discussion **Spoilers**

Postby raptornx01 » Mon Jun 18, 2012 2:50 pm

It says he takes one of its lives, but doesn't kill it. he does kill various insects though.
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Re: The Light Fantastic Discussion **Spoilers**

Postby =Tamar » Mon Jun 18, 2012 10:40 pm

He also let Scrofula take over once when he was busy... this could be one reason he decided he needed an apprentice, not so much a replacement as an assistant.
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