Wintersmith Discussion *Spoilers*

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Postby Doughnut Jimmy » Sat Feb 12, 2011 6:59 pm

I see what you're getting at Brocolee but I think its a fair assumption that Pratchett also meant the books to be read by adults so its not unreasonable to comment on them from that perspective.

As you say there are some stories that appeal to both groups very well, I think what really disappoints me about Wintersmith is that Wee Free Men managed that so much better
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Postby Jan Van Quirm » Sat Feb 12, 2011 8:01 pm

Well the clue's in the publishing specification surely - they're for young adults. Some would argue that this is in itself patronising, but the inference is there - the books may be written about children but it's for those on their way to maturity... That covers soooo much possibility it's untrue, no matter how old you are :lol:

However, WFM keeps getting a mention and just with how that starts with Jenny Greenteeth and the frying pan, Tiffany is not by any definition a 'young' girl. What would appeal to me if I were a 'young adult' still is that there's hardly a whiff of dumbing down in the series - its whole environment's gritty as befits a rural/farming community where the kids work their passage as much as the grown-ups as it would have been in compatible times in the crofts of Scotland say (or out in antipodes :P ) at the turn of the 19th century with travelling teachers and children brought up to help out in the dairies etc. In Wintersmith and the 2 previous books Tiffany's 'right' for the age she's depicted at if a little solemn and more serious than other children because of her inherited talents with her granny certainly making a huge impression throughout and the echoes of that run through all her books with Roland too in terms of legacy and continuity which are important to kids as they grow up in those close-knit communities. I think this is also why we like the Witches so much because they are the lynchpins of the Chalk and Ramtops communities and Tiffany's journey, clever and exceptional as she is, is still simply a part of the cycle. :wink:
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Postby raisindot » Sat Feb 12, 2011 8:22 pm

Broccolee wrote:I just thought of The Prisoner of Azkaban,for instance.
Dan Brown also gets rather spooky and mythical,but he wouldn´t be readable for kids.


Even J.K. Rowling's worst HP are better than Dan Brown's execrable potboilers. Talk about childish plots, inept dialogue and cliche-ridden set pieces. If it wasn't for the crypto-religious stuff in 'em no one would even read 'em. Blechhh!
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Postby rockershovel » Sat Feb 12, 2011 9:08 pm

I'm not personally a fan of any of the Tiffany books. They seem to me to have more than a touch of "Niven syndrome", the increasingly laboured efforts to close out and link various characters who were not originally connected at all. They aren't as bad as the "Ringworld" series but definitely heading in that general direction.

Wee Mad Arthur and the Feegles - both quite good one-joke characters - are a case in point.

I'm disappointed with this, because the "mainstream" books - especially ones involving Ankh-Morpork - have numerous continuity errors or contradictions, or simple changes, which TP freely admitted were introduced for the sake of a better joke, or because his ideas had developed.

Death is the best example of this, with ideas like the endless desert being introduced simply because they seem like a good idea. Death's house varies considerably in detail from book to book, as does the character of Susan.


There's nothing wrong with this. Many authors have done the same. It's fairly obvious that Conan Doyle little idea of the actual layout of London, and a similar error occurs in "the missing threequarter" where Holmes walks between three Cambridgeshire villages in an afternoon, in fact a distance of about forty miles.

look at the various versions of Hitchikers' Guide
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Postby DaveC » Sat Apr 02, 2011 6:34 pm

I've just had a daydream about an assassin, in traditional garb, doing the Dark Morris. Painfully. :o Imagine the textured silence punctuated by sharp nicks and cuts...
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Postby Pearwood » Thu Aug 04, 2011 3:01 pm

I just finished this yesterday and found it pretty enjoyable. The first half was definitely stronger with Miss Treason and her Boffo one of Terry's most amusing ideas in a while. Annagramma's arc was pretty engaging as well.

Wasn't so keen on the ending - Roland's flipping out at the bogles seem to come from nowhere and I found the resolution with Roland freeing Summer as Tiffany does the heat transfer trick all a bit pat. The Feegles were great however and I'm possibly alone in loving Horace.

All in all, I liked it better than Hat Full of Sky which I found kinda dull, but it's definitely not as good as Wee Free Men.

By the way, was that Magrat who was nursing Tiffany when she wakes up in Nanny's house?
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Postby Tonyblack » Thu Aug 04, 2011 3:09 pm

Hey Pearwood! Good to see you again. :)
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Postby Pearwood » Thu Aug 04, 2011 11:26 pm

Thanks. :D
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Re: Wintersmith Discussion *Spoilers*

Postby Discworldpadawan » Sat May 10, 2014 9:22 am

Just finished wintersmith yesterday all, seems a lot of negativity towards it at the beginning of this thread? Cant see why!! I enjoyed it more than hat full of sky, thought it had a lot more guts to it! Especially enjoyed the visit to Lancre and Tir Nanny Oog (the tiffany series is my first real introduction to any discworld witches), also enjoyed Roland being developed to an extent at last! Gutted Annagramma got help to succeed in her new cottage role tho, - I'd like to have seen her fail for her spitefulness, is that wrong of me??!! :D :D I suppose that wouldn't have been in keeping with the spirit of things though. Now, Onto I shall wear midnight!!! :)
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Re: Wintersmith Discussion *Spoilers*

Postby simmonds91 » Mon May 12, 2014 9:27 am

Sorry but i just had to mention this, rockershovel has brought to mind angua and her transformations, in the tv adaptation of going postal her wolf form is a traditional upright werewolf and in The Truth in Biers the werewolf there is also an upright werewolf (standing on two feet), however in every picture paul kidby has drawn she is depicted as a wolf (non werewolf wolf if you know what i mean) and of course written as one with a collar and everything. it's been bugging me for a while.
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Re: Wintersmith Discussion *Spoilers*

Postby The Mad Collector » Mon May 12, 2014 10:31 am

In the tv adaptation she also reveals that she is a werewolf to people and changes in public something she never does in the books, it's yet another annoying error in the adaptations like the chessboard as a thud board in the same film :roll:
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Re: Wintersmith Discussion *Spoilers*

Postby Tonyblack » Mon May 12, 2014 11:17 am

Werewolves in Wintersmith?? I don't recall that. Possibly best to discuss that point in one of the discussions for The Truth or another where Angua/werewolves play a prominent role. :)
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Re: Wintersmith Discussion *Spoilers*

Postby =Tamar » Tue May 13, 2014 1:40 am

Variations in werewolf form are explained in The Fifth Elephant, and shown quite early, in Moving Pictures.
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