Religions say that suicide and Euthanasia is way to the hell

Moderators: Jason, Toothy, Tonyblack

Postby meerkat » Wed Aug 17, 2011 1:48 pm

Where's Evergreen gone? Have we scared him off? :shock:
Just a meerkat from The Effing Forest
User avatar
meerkat
Member
 
Posts: 13414
Joined: Sat Jan 16, 2010 6:32 pm
Location: Wilberfoss East Riding Yorkshire

Postby Jan Van Quirm » Wed Aug 17, 2011 2:26 pm

OK - I was going to go cite suicide bombing as an exception to that statement that JIB as usual has homed in on as the thing to quote out of context. :roll:

I chose not to mention that because this is about suicide/euthanasia and not terrorism, patriotism, jihadism/crusading or any other politicised abstraction involving violence and/or oppression and war-like activities because this is about the purely 'normal' human consequences of taking your own life for whatever reason. Religious zealotry/oppression comes under politics ultimately, dress it up however you like :x What Evergreen is talking about is the normal social stigma of suicide and/or assisted death outside of those parameters and it's effects on normal people regardless of faith issues to some extent although most religions proscribe it ordinarily for the reasons you've rightly set out - I agree with those.

What I was and am talking about is the devastation that someone leaves behind them when they take themselves out of the circle of family affection and support with very little or no reason and very often without any warning whatsoever to indicate that they're in distress or ill and commit suicide. Whatever the reason for them going off and jumping off a tall building, or overdosing thoroughly and beyond rescue, or driving themselves off Beachy Head, suicides leave everyone they know utterly shocked and appalled at their actions, followed very swiftly by guilt and trauma at not realising why they'd felt compelled to do such an awful thing that leaves their nearest and dearest without a parent/child/sibling etc and unable to even know how they might have helped to lessen or take away the need for such a terrible solution. I don't care if somebody thinks they have nobody to care what they do - there's always somebody who's there to feel grief and shock over a 'needless' death, even if it's 'only' the poor driver of the bus you chose to walk to oblivion under and the people who were late for work or other myriad and mundane human consequences that will be a result of the traffic chaos caused by that? :evil:

Suicide is a ripple effect, no matter what you do and euthanasia/assisted death is one way to minimise the cause and effect by doing so in a rationalised and inclusive manner so the people you leave behind are in no doubt as to the reason and inevitability of your needing to die and so they are at least spared one shock in knowing it was your genuine choice and they could have done nothing to prevent it. I'll go one further and say that assisted death (not euthanasia as that implies a constraint of choice), actually empowers those left behind to mourn you more comfortably because they may well know that their counsel and/or support will have been of use to you in making the decision even if they did not agree with what you were doing simply because they had an opportunity to voice their opinion before you took that final step of your choice.

The human reaction to premature death is universal and whether or not you are a person of faith (and I am most certainly not such a person) if someone you loved died a sudden, unnecessary and, above all, unanticipated self-administered death you would have wished you could have a) stopped them doing it and b) at least have had a chance to help them in some way before they were too far gone is despair or whatever - that is the reasoning most religions focus on in condemning suicide, not the other extremisms and that is all I meant by the comment. :(
"Some men see things as they are and ask why. Others dream things that never were and ask why not.” George Bernard Shaw
User avatar
Jan Van Quirm
Member
 
Posts: 10316
Joined: Fri Nov 07, 2008 9:07 pm
Location: Dunheved, Kernow

Postby Jan Van Quirm » Wed Aug 17, 2011 2:26 pm

meerkat wrote:Where's Evergreen gone? Have we scared him off? :shock:

Quite possibly! :P
"Some men see things as they are and ask why. Others dream things that never were and ask why not.” George Bernard Shaw
User avatar
Jan Van Quirm
Member
 
Posts: 10316
Joined: Fri Nov 07, 2008 9:07 pm
Location: Dunheved, Kernow

Postby poohcarrot » Wed Aug 17, 2011 2:37 pm

Jan Van Quirm wrote:Religious zealotry/oppression comes under politics ultimately, dress it up however you like :x

What's the difference between religious zealotry/oppression and voting against the debt ceiling because it doesn't matter anyhoos because the Rapture-is-a-coming.

Doesn't all religion come under politics? :?
"Disliking Carrot would be like kicking a puppy."
"You kicked a puppy," Lobsang said accusingly.
User avatar
poohcarrot
Member
 
Posts: 10425
Joined: Sun Sep 13, 2009 12:11 pm
Location: NOT The land of the risen Son!!

Postby Jan Van Quirm » Wed Aug 17, 2011 3:05 pm

Yes. Some of it's about supporting the community as well which is also politics isn't it? You can believe in god if you want and not be a complete A-hole about it if you try hard enough can't you? :roll:
"Some men see things as they are and ask why. Others dream things that never were and ask why not.” George Bernard Shaw
User avatar
Jan Van Quirm
Member
 
Posts: 10316
Joined: Fri Nov 07, 2008 9:07 pm
Location: Dunheved, Kernow

Re: Religions say that suicide and Euthanasia is way to the

Postby Evergreen » Sat Mar 23, 2013 6:45 pm

I think being dead is better then having bad life full of pain and tears. So i totally support euthanasia, expect one thing i do not support euthanasia only if person who doing suicide got children and if children doesnt agree about their parents suicide, because life is hard for people who didnt have parents.

But if children is old enuff and support their parents decision thats probably okay.

I know that most atheists/agnostics support euthanasia and most christians dont, i havent seen anything wrong about suicide in Bible, and most christians probably doesnt actully care what Bible says for example - sex until marriage is banned in Bible and Quran but most people who call themself christians/jews and some people who call themselfes muslims doesnt care about that and losing virginity when they are 13 years old. Horever those religius people who doesnt care what Bible says about sex and other stuff still doesnt support euthanasia and saying that s"uiciders will burn in hell forever"

In some countries with big number of atheists like Switzerland - euthanasia is legalised, but euthanasia probably wont be legalised in USA cas unlike some european countries full of atheists most people in USA believe in God. Like 80% people in Sweden doesnt believe in God and like 50-60-98% people in USA believe in God.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Demographics_of_atheism

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Irreligion_by_country

Thanks

___

As for banishing suicide - goverment req slaves, and slaves have bad lifes full of pain - so goverment wont support suicide because they need many slaves.

And also some people are egoists who care about themselfes who think that its okay if other people will have life full of pain but its not okay if their own life will be full of pain.

When some one is rich and handsome its easy for him to blame suiciders since his own life is too good for killing himself.But when people usually feel nothing but pain they want to die, many of them want to live but they probably know that they have no chanses of having good life.

Some people who doesnt have eyes,legs and hands is happy, but not all. Life is good thing only if people are happy, having good health, and money. But if they are both have horrible diseases and not happy at all they deserve to die - if they want to die.
Evergreen
New member
 
Posts: 8
Joined: Tue Aug 16, 2011 11:26 am
Location: Europe

Re: Religions say that suicide and Euthanasia is way to the

Postby simmonds91 » Sat Mar 23, 2013 11:12 pm

The way I see it, If I want to end my life then I will do so, nobody has any right to tell me whether I can die or not. I consider my choice to off myself a sacred thing and will do so at any point in time if I wanted to. (I have fantasies where I light myself on fire in my garden just to spite people "yeah I'm killing myself! What you gonna do about it!!") As for anyone else..... I could care less if they wanted to kill themselves, each to their own and good luck to them I say. Though id probably stop them if it was right next to me, it will cause ME problems if I'm close by when they kill themselves.
Well, you know what they say. The past is a foreign country - - With an outdated military and huge oil reserves!
simmonds91
Member
 
Posts: 220
Joined: Mon Oct 29, 2012 10:57 am

Re: Religions say that suicide and Euthanasia is way to the

Postby Square12 » Mon Apr 08, 2013 10:42 pm

After hearing that a friend (whom admittedly I didn't have any rl contact with anymore) and former housemate recently committed suicide. The first thing I thought was at least she now has the peace she could never find in life. I personally am polytheistic, I believe in the existence of all the gods for much the same reason that the discworld gods exist belief in an entity creates its existence, although not necessarily physical existence. I don't hold to the tenets of any of the major faiths but am moderately superstitious and pay token worship to the various trickster and luck gods. I diverge, basically my friend had a lot of clinical psychological issues dating back at least 10 years, and also some physical issues to make things even worse. She had reinvented herself on several occasions but it hadn't worked and I think she saw it as the only way out. I hope that she believed in a better place after death and that she is there now.
If you can fill the unforgiving minute,
With sixty seconds worth of distance run,
Yours is the Earth and everything that's in it,
And - which is more - you'll be a man my son.
User avatar
Square12
Member
 
Posts: 721
Joined: Mon Apr 08, 2013 10:03 pm
Location: Madrid

Re: Religions say that suicide and Euthanasia is way to the

Postby Evergreen » Mon Jun 10, 2013 6:03 am

People saying that "all suiciders going to the hell" because rich people using poor people as slaves, and slaves/poor people have very bad life quality so they want to die, but rich people doesnt want poor people get dead because they using them as slaves/workers/servants etc

And also because suiciders can escape "punishment" like being burned alive and other slow and painful deaths by killing themselves with fast and easy death. Suicide also can help escape being enslaved during war, because being captived during war is no different then being slave.

Life is good only when life is full of happiness and pleasure, but when life becomes nothing but pain - fast and easy death is better. Evryone deserves to live if he wants so, but also almost evryone deserves fast and easy death like euthanasia if he wants to die.

(sry for my horrible english)
Evergreen
New member
 
Posts: 8
Joined: Tue Aug 16, 2011 11:26 am
Location: Europe

Previous

Return to Terry Pratchett

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Google [Bot] and 1 guest