Maskerade Discussion *Spoilers*

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Postby Tonyblack » Sat Aug 14, 2010 8:53 am

Does anyone else think that the whole book thing was a ploy engineered by Nanny to get Granny to A-M?

We are made to believe that Nanny is being conned by the publisher, but I think she is far too canny to let that happen. She knows it will get Granny's attention and cause her to act superior. Nanny is pretty good at Headology as well. :wink:
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Postby Doughnut Jimmy » Sat Aug 14, 2010 9:11 pm

No, or at least not entirely.

Although I agree Nanny is probably devious enough for it I don't think there's much in the book to suggest it was a set up, more a case of improvising with what came along.
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Postby raisindot » Wed Aug 18, 2010 12:40 pm

Well, I finally ended up re-reading the whole thing again, and my opinion hasn't changed. For me, this is still one of the weaker entries in the series.

There just seemed to be so many things that were "forced" in this. Even if PTerry's attempt was to create an operatic novel about opera, it just doesn't work for me. The thing about opera is that (if you like it) you're willing to forgive the silly plots because the music and singing is so good. A novel that uses operatic conventions, however, is just silly.

Things that really annoyed me:

1. The overuse of exclamation marks. Yes, this an an overdramatic convention, but still endlessly annoying.

2. The endless repeating of the phrase, "The show must go on."

3. The witches acting totally out of character. Why would someone like Granny Weatherwax, who never claims to be anything other than she is, dress up in finery and fake an identity just to get into the opera box she could have easily gotten into by using witchery? If this is supposed to be part of the whole notion of her needed a diversion from the humdrum of Lancre, it just seems very unnatural.

4. Agnes. I don't get her character here. She'll be totally submissive to Christine and to the opera people, but she is very disrespectul to Granny Weatherwax, someone she knows could do her great harm. And she just isn't strong enough a character to carry the story, which is why PTerry dropped in the other witches.

5. The misuse of Nobby and Detritus. Their appearance seems to be a sop to the Watch fans, but they add nothing. And the references to Detritus as the stupidest troll in the city are a bit cruel, given his demonstration of genius intelligence in the Pork Futures Warehouse in Men at Arms.

Fortunately, Pterry recovered from this and was back to peak form in "Feet of Clay," which came after this.

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Postby poohcarrot » Wed Aug 18, 2010 12:49 pm

Sorry J-I*b, but I still agree with you. :(
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Postby Doughnut Jimmy » Wed Aug 18, 2010 1:02 pm

Well I don't :)

I agree this isn't one of the books that deals with deep themes but I find it an entertaining read.

J-I-B wrote:3. The witches acting totally out of character. Why would someone like Granny Weatherwax, who never claims to be anything other than she is, dress up in finery and fake an identity just to get into the opera box she could have easily gotten into by using witchery? If this is supposed to be part of the whole notion of her needed a diversion from the humdrum of Lancre, it just seems very unnatural.


I think Granny does it for fun, I can certainly believe she would see the appeal in overawing Mr Bucket into selling her the box and generally discomforting the posh types. Don't forget she spends most of her time practising misdirection and exploiting peoples gullability. She may know who she is but that's not necessarily the face her clients see - a fact we come across again and again in Lords and Ladies and Carpe Jugulum.

4. Agnes. I don't get her character here. She'll be totally submissive to Christine and to the opera people, but she is very disrespectul to Granny Weatherwax, someone she knows could do her great harm. And she just isn't strong enough a character to carry the story, which is why PTerry dropped in the other witches.

My impression is that Agnes is submissive to the opera crowd because she wants to be part of them and in order to live her dream she can't really allow herself to see how ridiculous much of it is. ANd actually this is very well done, the bits where Agnes takes an outsiders view are quite believable.
Is it really likely that Granny would do Agnes much harm? She's the good witch after all. Agnes understands that much however much she wants to get away from Lancre and becoming a witch into an easier and much less demanding life.
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Postby Dotsie » Wed Aug 18, 2010 1:32 pm

raisindot wrote:3. The witches acting totally out of character. Why would someone like Granny Weatherwax, who never claims to be anything other than she is, dress up in finery and fake an identity just to get into the opera box she could have easily gotten into by using witchery? If this is supposed to be part of the whole notion of her needed a diversion from the humdrum of Lancre, it just seems very unnatural.

I do have to disagree with this point. Firstly, Granny often claims to be something other than she is, when for example she hams up the harmless old lady act. Secondly, this method of getting into the box is witchery. She doesn't use magic when faking it (or "headology") will do. Thirdly, women like dressing up, which is clearly the motivation for this particular plan, and women who rely on clothes donations from grateful villagers probably don't get the chance very often.
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Postby poohcarrot » Wed Aug 18, 2010 2:29 pm

Dotsie wrote: Thirdly, women like dressing up,

Bet if I'd said that I'd have been called a sexist pig! :lol:
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Postby Dotsie » Wed Aug 18, 2010 2:44 pm

Not by me. But maybe :P
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Postby poohcarrot » Wed Aug 18, 2010 2:49 pm

So what you're saying Dotsie, is that you'll be tarting yourself up for the Con. :lol:
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Postby Dotsie » Wed Aug 18, 2010 2:51 pm

I already look like a tart. No extra work is necessary :D
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Postby Jan Van Quirm » Wed Aug 18, 2010 2:53 pm

poohcarrot wrote:
Dotsie wrote: Thirdly, women like dressing up,

Bet if I'd said that I'd have been called a sexist pig! :lol:


You'd be disappointed if we didn't give you a slap choochy face :wink:

Yes we like to dress up once in a while, but I think the real reason Granny wanted the full monty opera gear was to squander Nanny's earnings - just keeping her hand in with the general spitefulness. She's not nice remember :lol:
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Postby poohcarrot » Wed Aug 18, 2010 2:53 pm

You could put sequins on your sports bra! :lol:
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Postby Jan Van Quirm » Wed Aug 18, 2010 2:55 pm

:roll: Dotsie may look like a tart but not a tacky one
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Postby Dotsie » Wed Aug 18, 2010 3:15 pm

Thanks Jan :wink:
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Postby Tonyblack » Wed Aug 18, 2010 3:34 pm

Can we try to keep this discussion on topic please? :)
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