Raising Steam *Warning Spoilers*

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Re: Raising Steam *Warning Spoilers*

Postby =Tamar » Sun Nov 17, 2013 2:23 am

TheAnts wrote:Why "Iron Girder"? You don't make engines out of girders. Do you? It's a weird sort of name. I wonder if he meant to call her "Iron Maiden" but thought he might get sued.


I think it might be a combination of "Gravel Gertie" and Gertrude Street in Australia which has a famous wrought iron company.
Gravel Gertie was a character in Dick Tracy who was homely but had beautiful hair and could play and sing well (which reminds me of the goblins). However, "a Gravel Gertie" is a bunker designed to contain low-order nuclear explosions, which reminds me of a reported incident in RS.

Alpha Wrought Iron (230 Gertrude St., Fitzroy, VIC Australia), "Recognised as the pinnacle of wrought iron craftsmanship in Australia, our reputation has been forged over 50 years." Sir Terry has visited Australia many times and may have been made aware of them.

Then there's the whole "girt by sea" element (TLC), and... well, the words "gird" and "girdle" are funny words with associations of speed and power: Puck says, "I'll put a girdle round about the Earth in forty minutes."
So maybe a "girder" could be "something that girds"- the Iron Girder could gird Ankh-Morpork faster than the average horse (and maybe faster than a golem horse).
Last edited by =Tamar on Sun Nov 17, 2013 5:39 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Raising Steam *Warning Spoilers*

Postby TheAnts » Sun Nov 17, 2013 10:47 am

I like that last explanation, though to me "gird" means "to put something round my middle in preparation for going somewhere or doing something". In Yorkshire "girt big" means "very big indeed", though I don't know if that has anything to do with middles!

If it had been "Gerda" it would have made more immediate sense to literal minded people like me!
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Re: Raising Steam *Warning Spoilers*

Postby TheAnts » Sun Nov 17, 2013 11:00 am

Who's Wee Dug wrote: I don't think Terry would have got sued if he had used Iron Maiden, because Maiden can't trademark the name as it was an instrument of torture, and it was from what they took the name for the group. I think the Feegles had a word in his lughole about watching the Iron Bru adverts as they state it's made from Girders. :lol:


Try telling their busy busy team of lawyers that :D It is trademarked indeed ... there might be some confusion between copyright and trademarking here, you can trademark nearly anything as long as nobody else has it trademarked on the current register for the country in question. You can't stop everyone using it for anything anywhere, but you can "bag" usage for areas of trade and stop people from using it for that. Fortuantely nobody now (as far as I know) does commercial manufacture of Iron things fitted with spikes and kittens, that I am reasonably sure won't be trademarked by the rock band, but you never know I bet they have an almost bottomless spectrum of memoribilia items covered ... anyway those guys in the 14th century clearly let their registrations lapse.

I'd forgotten about Irn Bru! So now we know what will happen to her when she gets a bit old and rusty.
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Re: Raising Steam *Warning Spoilers*

Postby =Tamar » Sun Nov 17, 2013 5:42 pm

TheAnts wrote: In Yorkshire "girt big" means "very big indeed"


Maybe "girter" would mean "even bigger" in Yorkshire?
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Re: Raising Steam *Warning Spoilers*

Postby TheAnts » Sun Nov 17, 2013 8:20 pm

I shall have to ask my even bigger Yorkshire friend next time I see him :D

I'm just watching Richard Hammond making a planet on my time shifter, and he's brought in 32 massive lorries of iron girders to build our planet! That's to provide the planetary 32% iron. I guess if you can make a planet out of girders, you can make a railway engine out of one too.
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Re: Raising Steam *Warning Spoilers*

Postby Tonyblack » Mon Nov 18, 2013 2:44 pm

I just finished this and really enjoyed it. I felt that there was a theme in there which Terry has been working into his books, on and off, for many years now. This time he was practically shouting it. :D

I'm not going to say what it is as - either you already know it, or if not, need to discover it for yourselves.

I must admit that, after Making Money, I was dreading another Moist book. I'm happy to say that I was wrong to think like that and actually ended up really understanding and even liking Mr von Lipwig. And it was nice to see such places as Zemphis and Uhulan Cutash again.

Do I think this was written by anyone other than Terry? Absolutely not! :naughty: People really do talk such rubbish.
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Re: Raising Steam *Warning Spoilers*

Postby Who's Wee Dug » Mon Nov 18, 2013 9:22 pm

So far I'm really enjoying it just past halfway, and it's turning into one of my favorites already, I agree with you Tony it has Pterry written all over it. :lol: pun intended. :mrgreen:
He willnae tak' a drink! I think he's deid! , on the other hand though A Midgie in yir hand is worth twa up yir kilt.
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Re: Raising Steam *Warning Spoilers*

Postby Tonyblack » Mon Nov 18, 2013 9:38 pm

I think we are going to have to stop calling him Pterry and now call him t'Erry. :lol:
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Re: Raising Steam *Warning Spoilers*

Postby One Man Bucket » Tue Nov 19, 2013 2:51 pm

One thing that annoyed me is that we never had Carrot interact with the Low King in the 5th Elephant and we missed another opportunity in this book. Heck we got the opinions of loads of people but not Carrot's. Carrot has shown himself to be open minded except when it comes to dwarfs, whilst hanging around Cheery may be helping I'd still like to hear his opinion with regards the dwarf events in this book. Terry might be done with him as far as his kingship but that doesn't mean we no longer want to see his POV
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Re: Raising Steam *Warning Spoilers*

Postby Teppic » Tue Nov 19, 2013 8:12 pm

Just finished the audiobook.

Yes, the style's changed, but that change was evident in Snuff too so why is anyone surprised? I don't like the long, unnatural speeches the characters make in the later books when apparently in conversation, but it didn't bother me as much in this book as it did in Snuff.

What this really is, for the first half of the book at least, is a spotter's guide to Discworld (nicely appropriate that - this book should really come with a ticklist and an anorak). I'm in no doubt that this book would be a real turn-off if I came to it cold or having read only one or two other DW books, but the first half of the book is so dense with old characters popping up, and sly references to events in past books, that I couldn't help but enjoy it - it made me feel like a complete geek to be honest. And the events whizzed past, with humour and quite a lot of darkness (lots of people killed in this book!) only really interrupted by the odd monologue's Terry seems to love now.

The train journey itself was well-written. The use of the buried golems was brilliant and I kicked myself for not figuring that out before it happened, but the flying train is one of the best images in any of the 40 DW books. I liked Vimes in this book much more than in Snuff where he was a bit of a 'Superman' and particularly liked the relationship he and Moist developed with a mutual respect growing between the two of them.

I have to say, having just re-read Monstrous Regiment, I did groan initially when the Low King 'came out'. I was half-expecting a conveyor belt of previously male characters turning out to be women. But it was a nice touch as it closed the chapter Cheery Littlebottom started all those years before.

Finally, the little twist at the end about where Vetinari had been was also great, remiscent of Night Watch.

Maybe we need a thread just to list the references to other DW books in Raising Steam, because I don't think there are many that weren't referred to in some way or another. As I said, spotter's guide defintely needed! 8-)
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Re: Raising Steam *Warning Spoilers*

Postby One Man Bucket » Tue Nov 19, 2013 8:28 pm

Reading your post just resolved something that was bugging me. Vetinari seemed somewhat out of character but I had put this down to a continuation of the development/changes we'd seen in his last appearance but they can all be put down to his double not getting his mannerisms quite right.

I'm glad Terry avoided the nightmare scenario that was the reality of Monstrous Regiment but there's not really any dwarfs for whom being male is all that important to their character or plot with the exception of Cassanunda
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Re: Raising Steam *Warning Spoilers*

Postby Who's Wee Dug » Tue Nov 19, 2013 9:08 pm

And it was not only DW books that were referred to, :mrgreen: I'm just 6 chapters from the end in the audio book, then a read of the book after that.
He willnae tak' a drink! I think he's deid! , on the other hand though A Midgie in yir hand is worth twa up yir kilt.
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Re: Raising Steam *Warning Spoilers*

Postby JAK » Wed Nov 20, 2013 2:53 pm

Just finished reading and overall I liked the book but my initial doubts about the speed of the introduction of steam travel were not really quashed; which is unfortunate because the means to do so were there – there just wasn’t anything written to confirm this had happened. There was the hint of a magical or living element at the start of the book and with the goblins making improvements to the clacks system I would have liked a ‘Tailor of Gloucester’ moment while Girder was just circling Harry’s yard to give credibility to the dramatic advancements that despite great amounts of money would have required much more time to perfect and progress.

I also felt it was written a bit like Dodger in that just about every known cliché, railway (rather than London), was thrown into the story (although I don’t remember the damsel chained to the tracks by her wicked uncle) - not that I mind this. We have the accept all that life throws at us so if there are two lifetimes worth of ideas rattling around in one’s head better they come out in a rush than be lost.

As a model maker I’m sorry that this book was written as it marks the end of the Discworld I know and love. Steam power and an industrial Revolution, as here, will cause major changes to the way people think and act – I liked the fantasy setting of a blend of a little beyond medieval but not quite Victorian. I can see the next book, certainly if set in AM, being closer to the steam punk genera, possibly with Moist explaining to Vetinari why the AM Gas and Electric Co. need to increase their charges by 30% each year and that he should be lowering rather than raising taxes.

Right, now time to read again to see what I missed or didn’t get first time round.
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Re: Raising Steam *Warning Spoilers*

Postby Jack Remillard » Wed Nov 20, 2013 6:59 pm

Really loved this one (I listened to the audiobook). :)

I wish it hadn't been such a sequel to 'Thud' though, as I had had planned to re-listen to the audiobook of that afterwards (as that is one of my favourites), and that ended up not seeming like the right order. :D

Oh well. Great book. :D
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Re: Raising Steam *Warning Spoilers*

Postby Bickaxe » Wed Nov 20, 2013 7:07 pm

Thoroughly enjoyed it despite not being surprised by some story lines.
Moist, while not hogging the limelight, is always fun to read for me with the things he gets up to when nobody is around. In his shoes, I like to think I would do the same, especially on the train roof
Vimes as a part player did what Vimes does in these situations.
Simnel was a likeable character, a straight down the like tell it like it is person (reminded me of Granny bit)
Vetinari did his thing as did Harry King which was all nice.

The seeds have been planted for other transportation plans but it does make me wonder where we will be going next in AM....
Fiendish til the en-
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